Discussion
To everybody currently experiencing the #Signal messenger downtime and precariousness of digital infrastructure that relies on servers, know that #Keet exists! It can preserve network connectivity and message deliverability in very degraded and hostile network conditions due to the absence of servers in its #p2p architecture.
The world needs resilient communications for what is to come. Don't let your whole network depend on one company.
@pospi Hi, I just discovered Keet through your post, thanks! I'm just curious though: any reason you'd know why they're only on X?
@nicolasfolliot maybe just historical reasons. The community actually mainly hangs out on Keet itself, there's a large public room advertised *somewhere* (somewhere obvious enough that I found it, anyways).
You could hop in there and ask the team. They're a friendly bunch :)
@pospi isn't this just depending on a different company?
@powersource yes and no. If you have the binary it's a fully functioning app and free forever, so not in the same way that server-run apps are.
In terms of maintenance and updates, we're dependent on @holepunch_to until they open-source the app. AFAIK (could be wrong) the delay is them holding on to the market advantage that their video compression + encryption algorithm gives, cos the quality is leagues above anything else. The networking stack is already open. Maybe it's gonna be a "wait for the patent, then the source code will follow" sort of situation.
@pospi yeah I feel like we were promised the source code a few years ago, and that alone wouldn't be enough. I'm gonna need a lot more to convince me to switch
@powersource yeah, I'm not talking about switching 🙂 I'm talking about backup resilient comms infrastructure. (And knowing you, maybe you're talking about #Scuttlebutt when you're talking about "switching", so 100% good point there with equivalence to #Keet- both are DHT-based handshake protocols that end in gossip peering; and one is OSS but the other is not.)
@racchio I don't know much about #Nostr, other than that it's a fascist-run project with a disastrous cultural history. But yes, #Keet is for IM and runs fully decentralised.
(I'm going to use that word rather than "distributed" as the architecture *does* actually facilitate the distribution of power as well as of compute & storage. It's also built by a pretty cool community of anarchists & anarcho-syndicalists, at least the ones I've met.)
@racchio there has been a lot of chatter about it on https://scuttlebutt.nz over the years, if you care to install Yet Another Distributed Social Network to dive deeper. It is the usual rhetoric & dog-whistles in #Nostr projects- "complete freedom of expression" "without the risk of de-platforming" predictably attracts bigots who want to shout hateful things. 'Big Tent' philosophy and the 'Nazi bar' outcome etc etc https://startup-weekly.com/Primal-launches-new-social-network-for-digital-freedom/
@racchio I've found @rabble's take on it to be a bit unfortunately underwhelming, given the antifascist work and organising that I know he does personally. I mostly read this post as deflection and free speech maximalism, but hey, one also has to wear a different hat when speaking on behalf of an organisation. In any case, I hope it's not too controversial to point out that the fact they've spoken about it publicly is indicative of the community discomfort around their political/moderation choices. https://www.nos.social/blog/on-nostr-fascism-and-the-ability-to-build-an-inclusive-digital-space
@pospi @racchio fiatjaf’s politics aren’t great but I think they’re also less coherent and thought out than the coverage makes out. It definitely is problematic. But the reason I work on permissionless social protocols is I don’t want to be dependent on the politics of one person or company. I do think there is good reason to kick someone out of your server or group or community if they don’t follow your values. But I’ll use tech from people I disagree with.
@rabble @racchio Thanks for that (RE fiatjaf), I'd forgotten the name & I am aware this is the more problematic topic than taking money from Dorsey.
I think there's nuance to be had in using tech from people we disagree with. Personally, I'll *use* it, but only if I can do so whilst giving NOTHING back. And that can be quite hard, because it means restraining from things like bug reports when you bump up against rough edges.
It is a systemic problem that talent and expertise end up pooled around cliques of hateful people, who increasingly have disproportionate access to mentorship and expertise over time as they push diverse contributors away. I have seen that happen in basically every community in #DWeb, save the scant couple of under-funded projects prepared to assert a culture of inclusion and maintain strong boundaries around conduct.
More or less this truth- https://kolektiva.social/@jaredwhite@indieweb.social/115391398337433244
@pospi I certainly welcome decentralized alternatives to Signal, but it cannot seem to find the source code? I.e. how do I know the security guarantees they proclaim are true? (I did not audit signal myself, I should add, but I do trust the multiple different & independent reviews, like from soatok)
A space for Bonfire maintainers and contributors to communicate
