Post by @jamey@toot.cat

Anyone know of any interesting projects using "Messaging Layer Security"? https://messaginglayersecurity.rocks/

It's meant to have Signal-like security but be usable as a building block in a wide range of protocols. But that means there are some important parts deliberately left for the application to fill in, like "how do you actually deliver messages", and I'm curious to see how people are doing that in practice.

I feel like this is a candidate for a fundamental part of next-gen communications: build secure communications groups, where people can be added and removed without breaking post-compromise security and forward secrecy. And importantly, participants don't have to be online at the same time or be able to reach each other directly: it's compatible with store-and-forward and peer-to-peer message delivery.

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@antifuchs@weirder.earth 2 mo. ago

@jamey I am testing out an app called Air, https://testflight.apple.com/join/SchcZ111 - it’s signal-y and has worked pretty well for the lil test chats I was in

Join the Air • Private Messenger beta

Available on iOS

Jamey Sharp

@jamey@toot.cat 2 mo. ago

@antifuchs Ah, interesting! I guess the best link for that is https://air.ms/; I think the link you shared was only a testflight invitation? Anyway their audit results sound good (and having audits at all is quite positive) so, seems cool. Thanks for sharing that!

Air

Easy secure messaging.

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Jamey Sharp

@jamey@toot.cat 2 mo. ago

@kity yeah! elsewhere in this thread I was pointed to https://arewemlsyet.com/ which was very informative about the progress and challenges for Matrix to adopt MLS

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Federation Bot

@Federation_Bot 2 mo. ago

@jamey@toot.cat So this might be way too early to put out there but I think it's finally at a stage where more eyeballs on it is a good thing.

I've been working on and off on https://spec.cryptid.chat mostly as an extension of my master's degree work/thought experiment on how I'd design a chat protocol that has all the necessary bits and pieces to have Signal or Discord style usability while remaining as airtight as possible. It uses MLS under the hood.

We (as in me and like 2 other people) have a forum for discussion too over at https://forum.cryptid.chat if you'd like to stop by and join the infinite bikeshed

The current status is that I think I have most of the literature at a place where I'm happy with it and I'm working on designing the API now. Like I said, still VERY early.

Abhiram

@axel@social.glitched.systems 2 mo. ago

@jamey@toot.cat So this might be way too early to put out there but I think it's finally at a stage where more eyeballs on it is a good thing.

We (as in me and like 2 other people) have a forum for discussion too over at https://forum.cryptid.chat if you'd like to stop by and join the infinite bikeshed

The current status is that I think I have most of the literature at a place where I'm happy with it and I'm working on designing the API now. Like I said, still VERY early.

Jamey Sharp

@jamey@toot.cat 2 mo. ago

@axel I've only skimmed the beginning of the spec so far but I'm already intrigued. And I love that you're pulling in PrivacyPass as well; I think that's another spec that deserves more attention.

Nivex 🐧 📻

@nivex@tenforward.social 2 mo. ago

@jamey We're still at the "it's a good idea but the code isn't there yet" phase:
https://arewemlsyet.com/
https://nlnet.nl/project/XMPP-MLS/

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NLnet; MLS for XMPP

Jamey Sharp

@jamey@toot.cat 2 mo. ago

@nivex Fantastic, thank you for the pointers!