Discussion
Sympathies. Limited ones.
Your pain is not dismissed, but is seen in context from watching MS take over my large employer's whole computing infrastructure, (1995-97), selling products for major large applications because they leveraged an OS to sell an office suite, after which everything had to be compatible, large and small. And was bad from the beginning.
And went on for 30+ years, because moving would be enormous.
@Floppy I agree with your sentiment but please cite your sources with your claims so that people can more easily accept them
@Floppy Are you maybe referring to this deleted thing? https://web.archive.org/web/20250925050230/https://world.hey.com/dhh
@trevdev this was the one in this specific case: https://world.hey.com/dhh/three-sacred-cows-that-must-die-so-europe-can-live-1afb203d. I prefer not to link it though, I’m sure he thrives on the attention.
@Floppy There's definitely a balance between "not platforming somebody" and "calling them out".
I am tired of these shit heads, too, I just really want them sold on being shitheads.
@Floppy yikes, I didn't expect that. Probably should've
@Floppy As far as I know, none of us in the #Ruby community claim this turd.
Also, #Hanami is better in every conceivable way, not least of which that they explicitly say this on the homepage:
The Hanakai community is a place where people of all backgrounds and experience levels can feel respected, and can share and grow. A place for people to be proud of, and feel safe within.
We do not tolerate nazis, transphobes, racists, or any kind of bigotry.
@ZiggyTheHamster we’re going to adopt similar aims; Hanakai are great. We’re just hoping to provide a way out for those folks with a lot of existing Rails code. I’d move to Hanami if I had the time (and still hope to in future).
Unfortunately, the general silence from the *majority* of the #Ruby community (not all) on DHH’s shit has been rather disappointing. The majority may not claim him, but they certainly tolerate him.
@Floppy there was a workshop on converting rails apps at RubyConf this year. I got the impression it was largely automated.
My local feed (on Ruby.social) is full of people pissed about DHH, for what it’s worth
@ZiggyTheHamster I think the Fediverse is in general much less willing to put up with his shit, yeah. That's why I like it here :)
Re: Hanami, it's not just Rails, there are a lot of things that *depend* on Rails, in particular Devise. Ideal world I'd love to move over. Practically, I need a stepping stone or two :)
@floppy My god, every time I read about this guy
@Floppy what an absolute 😤
I am ashamed of the fact that I’m stuck on #Rails because of the sunk costs of what I’ve already built, as are *so many* other project like Mastodon.
We cannot “just move”, the cost is enormous.
The Rails core team seem utterly compromised and under his spell. Nobody will speak out.
We need a hard #RailsFork. Now. And we need to coordinate to do it together and build a team.
I’m in. Who else?
@Floppy
Neme suggestion: funicular
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/funicular
It's fun, lofty, and gets you from a to b.
@floppy I don't remember when it was the last time I wrote a line of Ruby, but I strongly support the initiative.
Seize the means!
@Floppy I really like the Ruby language and hate the way this guy sucks up the air in every room.
@Floppy I really like the Ruby language and hate the way this guy sucks up there in every room.
@Floppy My main Rails gig right now is for a relatively conservative industry group and I've even gotten concerns from individual members therein.
The model structure is too complex to just port the app and there are 3rd parties that depend on it.
So count me in, I guess?
Sympathies. Limited ones.
Your pain is not dismissed, but is seen in context from watching MS take over my large employer's whole computing infrastructure, (1995-97), selling products for major large applications because they leveraged an OS to sell an office suite, after which everything had to be compatible, large and small. And was bad from the beginning.
And went on for 30+ years, because moving would be enormous.
@Floppy Briefly describe your plan, and I'd probably want to join.
I have been writing Ruby code for some twenty years; very rarely touched any Rails. Ended up making a couple of things that do some things that Rails does, albeit differently; the one that had most staying power was a basic application server framework I dubbed Pyramid; its most distinct characteristic was focusing on #LiterateProgramming kind of application development. It used to be proprietary; things have changed since, and now I have full rights to it, although haven't done a public release yet. Insomuch as it would make sense, I'd be happy to share and/or adapt some Pyramid code.
(Tempted to suggest naming the new project Ziggurat, after the Asimov quip about cavemen's railroads and ziggurats being built without computers. It kind of ... fits?)
@matthew Uh oh what happened in the rails community now?
@Floppy I’m sure there’s enough GPU in the field to have a LLM rebuild rails from scratch in rust before the weekend is out based on the test suite alone
@floppy no idea what this is
@Floppy I feel for you 😢
As far as I know, my current stack doesn't have anyone that bad, but who knows what tomorrow might bring 😭
I still naively want to believe that tech groups could eventually push that toxicity out, but history has not proven that to be correct yet ☹️
@Floppy hell this might make me excited about rails again.
the silence from the rails dev community, many of whom i considered friends and colleagues, has been deafening
@floppy I think a hard fork of Ruby on Rails is the best way from here. I don't personally use it or know any of it and I would love to help out if I actually could but alas my area isn't that... good luck though!
@Floppy forking rails would be a hell of a statement. it would be a lot of work, but worth it, i think.
but we shouldn't think it will completely solve the problem, because, practically speaking, who is pulling the strings at Ruby Central these days?
OpenRails? Or would Rails be dropped altogether and a new name selected?
@simonzerafa it would have to be different, he owns the trademark
@Floppy @simonzerafa Ruby on Bikes?
@Floppy not a Ruby dev here, but boosting in the hope that it can help
@Floppy Can't wait for Matz to once again proclaim that DHH did nothing wrong. /s
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