Discussion
«According to a study, more than two-thirds of Germans believe that their ancestors were not Nazis. Nearly 36% believe that their relatives were among the victims, and over 30% believe that their ancestors helped victims of the Nazis — for example, by hiding Jews. But this can't possibly be true. Only about 1% of Germans actively resisted.»
If folks wonder how the German 'remembrance culture is going 🙈
https://www.dw.com/en/how-do-germans-cope-with-having-nazi-grandparents/a-77886590
@gedankenstuecke sometimes it's not black and white. 1 grandpa joined the NSDAP when he was 18. And he deserted the Wehrmacht 1942 in Russia and would have been shot immediately if found. He hid 3 years in a cellar until the end of the war. Not sure where to count him in.
@gedankenstuecke I am German, born after the Second World War. From what my parents and grandparents have told me, I know that many Germans opposed the Nazi regime. My parents were children at the time and were forced to go along with their school classes to events where they had to cheer. They hated it. The Nazis’ propaganda spread nothing but misinformation. Nobody dared to speak out against it. I believe that the majority of Germans were against the regime.
@Maritime I unfortunately think that view doesn't hold up in light of the evidence of how people voted for Nazis (which in itself was close to a majority), plus the people who were at best indifferent Mitläufer. People might have had late regrets but absolutely supported them in the rise to power.
And on the anecdotal level: Being German too, I can tell you that the recently released membership records of the NSDAP (to which no one was forced to join) included both my grandfathers.
@gedankenstuecke The potential parallels between this and white America's very common and mostly false informal family lore that we share some Native American (and/or only non slave owning abolitionist) ancestors are fascinating. It's not The Same Thing but it feels like some tangled bits of the same larger knot
Germany's public stance on zionism is explained by your analysis too.
Staatsrason.
Singularity logical fallacy.
Being the second largest exporter of arms to a genocide.
Violently crushing anti-genocide voices.
Issuing an arrest warrant fora British doctor to prevent him from testifying on his experience in Gaza in Germany.
A normal society doesn't do this.
@gedankenstuecke Call me confused but if more people THINK their grandparents resisted than actually did ... wouldn't that bode WELL for their attitudes now? As in "...my grandparents resisted, so I shall resist too..." or something? Telling people "No, you're wrong, your grandparents actually just went along with everything the Nazis did..." somehow seems a good deal less motivating for the current moment. 🤷
@phf could easily be the other way around though, e.g. "if so many people will resist I don't have to" or "wow, if 30% of people resisted and it didn't stop the Nazis, why bother trying". I think for the current moment it's important to be clear about how the vast majority of people didn't do shit or actively tried profiteering back then.
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