Post · bonfire.cafe

@neil@mastodon.neilzone.co.uk · 2 hours ago

If you are in the UK/EU and tempted by Thunderbird Pro, it seems that:

* the contract does not include a data processing agreement. It is unclear how any professional user in the UK/EU might use the service in a manner consistent with the UK or EU GDPR.

* the servers are in Germany but the agreement (and presumably MZLA) are subject to US law:

> this Agreement between you and MZLA and any access to or use of the Website or the Services are governed by the federal laws of the United States of America and the laws of the State of California, without regard to conflict of law provisions. You and MZLA agree to submit to the exclusive jurisdiction and venue of the courts located in the City and County of San Francisco, California.

https://www.tb.pro/en-GB/terms/

Thunderbird

Terms — Thunderbird Pro

Thunderbird Pro Terms.

Johan van der Knijff

@bitsgalore@digipres.club · 56 minutes ago

@neil Out of curiosity I ran their main email domain through this tool by @internet_nl, which tests for modern internet standards:

https://internet.nl/mail/thundermail.com/1853398/

Now to be fair I've seen far worse, and the service isn't operational yet. But for a "pro" service it doesn't exactly inspire a lot of confidence (the same tool gives me a 100% score on my own email domain) .

Email test: thundermail.com

Test for modern Internet Standards IPv6, DNSSEC, HTTPS, HSTS, DMARC, DKIM, SPF, STARTTLS, DANE, RPKI and security.txt

Root Moose

@RootMoose@mastodon.bsd.cafe · 1 hour ago

@neil Regardless of what words are in the agreements, any data housed under the Thunderbird Pro banner will be subject to NSA/DHS/CIA visibility.

To think otherwise is naive.

Just don't go there.

pascal guldener

@zhksh@sigmoid.social · 1 hour ago

@neil dead on arival. Il stick with gmail and self hosted on germany

Neil Brown

@neil@mastodon.neilzone.co.uk · 2 hours ago

Having read the rest of the terms, in particular the warranties (or lack thereof), and the broad language around suspension and termination, my personal opinion is that I'd only use this as a means of making a donation to MZLA.

Personally, I wouldn't feel comfortable using it to actually host my email, calendaring, etc.

Simon Hewison

@zymurgic@mastodon.online · 2 hours ago

@neil 'We have the right to refuse or remove any User-Generated Content that, in our sole discretion, violates any laws or any of our terms or policies.'

So, if someone's calendar entries refer to something that /may/ be illegal or questionable in another legal jurisdiction, they might just delete that entry without warning? I can think of certain medical appointments.

Simon Zerafa

@simonzerafa@infosec.exchange · 2 hours ago

@neil

Interesting. The tb.pro FAQ says:

"Where will my data be hosted?

Your emails are protected by strict EU privacy laws and hosted on infrastructure you can trust. With servers located in Germany, Thundermail prioritizes your privacy while ensuring reliable, fast delivery worldwide."

🤔🤷‍♂️