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Michael Dexter
Michael Dexter boosted
Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 4 days ago

I yapped pretty hard about my own thoughts and opinions on some #OpenZFS stuff today, including:

- how we could make `zfs diff` nicer by tracking all hardlink parents
- some of the stuff that OpenZFS knows internally but doesn't currently expose to userspace, but could if anyone asked
- per-vdev queue tuning via properties instead of global tunables
- initial musings on a dataset type that exposes a S3-compatible API
- the size and scope of a flash-friendly redesign

On that last, the simplest and most important question was asked: how much $$$? I've been thinking about that all morning; not just the amount, but how there are people out there with cash that actually want stuff, but they aren't just gonna hand it out without a plan. This is obvious, but I'm just a tiny baby in the programmer-for-hire world; I learn slowly 😅 Some ideas are brewing, more on that soon I hope.

Thanks @dexter for the platform (and the patience; he's been subject to similar yaps from me in private, and is always a thoughtful and gracious host)!

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Michael Dexter
Michael Dexter boosted
Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 5 days ago

2.4 getting close now! #OpenZFS

https://github.com/openzfs/zfs/releases/tag/zfs-2.4.0-rc2

GitHub

Release zfs-2.4.0-rc2 · openzfs/zfs

We are excited to announce the second release candidate (RC2) of OpenZFS 2.4.0! Supported Platforms Linux: compatible with 4.18 - 6.17 kernels FreeBSD: compatible with releases starting from 13.3+...
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Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 4 days ago

The recording of the October 1st, 2025 #OpenZFS Production User Call is up:

https://youtu.be/94D7w4SEdHg

We discussed the upcoming User and Developer Summit, libzfs, 'zfs diff' behavior, orphaned files, extended attributes, metadata handling, stream(8), flash-native OpenZFS, a hypothetical S3 front-end for the OpenZFS object store, reproducible workloads, drama generators, and more!

"Don't forget to slam those Like and Subscribe buttons."

You now can support Call For Testing on Patreon: https://patreon.com/CallForTesting

Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol replied  ·  activity timestamp 4 days ago

I yapped pretty hard about my own thoughts and opinions on some #OpenZFS stuff today, including:

- how we could make `zfs diff` nicer by tracking all hardlink parents
- some of the stuff that OpenZFS knows internally but doesn't currently expose to userspace, but could if anyone asked
- per-vdev queue tuning via properties instead of global tunables
- initial musings on a dataset type that exposes a S3-compatible API
- the size and scope of a flash-friendly redesign

On that last, the simplest and most important question was asked: how much $$$? I've been thinking about that all morning; not just the amount, but how there are people out there with cash that actually want stuff, but they aren't just gonna hand it out without a plan. This is obvious, but I'm just a tiny baby in the programmer-for-hire world; I learn slowly 😅 Some ideas are brewing, more on that soon I hope.

Thanks @dexter for the platform (and the patience; he's been subject to similar yaps from me in private, and is always a thoughtful and gracious host)!

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Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 4 days ago

The recording of the October 1st, 2025 #OpenZFS Production User Call is up:

https://youtu.be/94D7w4SEdHg

We discussed the upcoming User and Developer Summit, libzfs, 'zfs diff' behavior, orphaned files, extended attributes, metadata handling, stream(8), flash-native OpenZFS, a hypothetical S3 front-end for the OpenZFS object store, reproducible workloads, drama generators, and more!

"Don't forget to slam those Like and Subscribe buttons."

You now can support Call For Testing on Patreon: https://patreon.com/CallForTesting

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Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 5 days ago

2.4 getting close now! #OpenZFS

https://github.com/openzfs/zfs/releases/tag/zfs-2.4.0-rc2

GitHub

Release zfs-2.4.0-rc2 · openzfs/zfs

We are excited to announce the second release candidate (RC2) of OpenZFS 2.4.0! Supported Platforms Linux: compatible with 4.18 - 6.17 kernels FreeBSD: compatible with releases starting from 13.3+...
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Stefano Marinelli
Stefano Marinelli boosted
Eva Winterschön
@winterschon@mastodon.bsd.cafe  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

I 💝 OpenZFS

Working on research for a HPC storage cluster, one of my architecture doc sections quote this information from the wonderful group at Klara:

> OpenZFS In the Wild
>
> .. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory (LLNL) undertook porting ZFS to Linux, to form the backbone of their Lustre distributed filesystem. They noted that OpenZFS facilitated building a storage system that could support 1 terabyte per second of data transfer at less than half the cost of any alternative filesystem.
>
> Based on the success seen at LLNL, Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL) started using ZFS as well.
>
> In the latest example, just a few months ago the U.S. Department of Energy’s Oak Ridge National Laboratory announced it had built Frontier, the world’s first exascale supercomputing system and currently the fastest computer in the world, backed by Orion, the massive 700 Petabyte ZFS based file system that supports it. This impressive system contains nearly 48,000 hard drives and 5,400 NVMe devices for primary storage, and another 480 NVMe just for metadata.

https://klarasystems.com/articles/openzfs-openzfs-for-hpc-clusters/#:~:text=built%C2%A0Frontier%2C%20the%20world%E2%80%99s%20first%20exascale,480%20NVMe%20just%20for%20metadata

#openzfs #zfs #freebsd #linux #engineering #supercomputing #hpc

Klara Systems

OpenZFS - OpenZFS For HPC Clusters - Klara Systems

Discover how OpenZFS enhances HPC cluster performance, reliability, and scalability with advanced storage management features.
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Michael Dexter
Stefano Marinelli
Michael Dexter and 1 other boosted
Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

My attempt at an #OpenZFS "libzfs" in /usr/include/openzfs PR for #FreeBSD:

https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=289655

Your wisdom please!

289655 – Add /usr/include/openzfs to support in-base and external applications

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Stefano Marinelli
Stefano Marinelli boosted
Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

The recording of the September 17th, 2025 #OpenZFS Production User Call is up:

https://youtu.be/KQpS0nDVDdc

We discussed the upcoming User and Developer Summit, OpenZFS on #FreeBSD i386, FreeBSD adduser(8) and native encryption, adding OpenZFS header files to FreeBSD's /usr/include, the recent Linux kernel compatibility issue, block tracing with workload replay, and more!

"Don't forget to slam those Like and Subscribe buttons."

You now can support Call For Testing on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/CallForTesting

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Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

The recording of the September 17th, 2025 #OpenZFS Production User Call is up:

https://youtu.be/KQpS0nDVDdc

We discussed the upcoming User and Developer Summit, OpenZFS on #FreeBSD i386, FreeBSD adduser(8) and native encryption, adding OpenZFS header files to FreeBSD's /usr/include, the recent Linux kernel compatibility issue, block tracing with workload replay, and more!

"Don't forget to slam those Like and Subscribe buttons."

You now can support Call For Testing on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/c/CallForTesting

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Eva Winterschön
@winterschon@mastodon.bsd.cafe  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

I 💝 OpenZFS

Working on research for a HPC storage cluster, one of my architecture doc sections quote this information from the wonderful group at Klara:

> OpenZFS In the Wild
>
> .. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory (LLNL) undertook porting ZFS to Linux, to form the backbone of their Lustre distributed filesystem. They noted that OpenZFS facilitated building a storage system that could support 1 terabyte per second of data transfer at less than half the cost of any alternative filesystem.
>
> Based on the success seen at LLNL, Los Alamos National Laboratory (LANL) started using ZFS as well.
>
> In the latest example, just a few months ago the U.S. Department of Energy’s Oak Ridge National Laboratory announced it had built Frontier, the world’s first exascale supercomputing system and currently the fastest computer in the world, backed by Orion, the massive 700 Petabyte ZFS based file system that supports it. This impressive system contains nearly 48,000 hard drives and 5,400 NVMe devices for primary storage, and another 480 NVMe just for metadata.

https://klarasystems.com/articles/openzfs-openzfs-for-hpc-clusters/#:~:text=built%C2%A0Frontier%2C%20the%20world%E2%80%99s%20first%20exascale,480%20NVMe%20just%20for%20metadata

#openzfs #zfs #freebsd #linux #engineering #supercomputing #hpc

Klara Systems

OpenZFS - OpenZFS For HPC Clusters - Klara Systems

Discover how OpenZFS enhances HPC cluster performance, reliability, and scalability with advanced storage management features.
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Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

My attempt at an #OpenZFS "libzfs" in /usr/include/openzfs PR for #FreeBSD:

https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=289655

Your wisdom please!

289655 – Add /usr/include/openzfs to support in-base and external applications

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Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago
@span mwl oh I'm the worst person to ask but here you go

personally: Debian LTS, with #ZFSBootMenu. I build my own #OpenZFS (dogfooding) but I'd have no issues running what Debian ships in the contrib repo. Setting up ZFSBootMenu is a little fiddly, but the docs are good and you only do it once

now all the "it depends", as all Linux-related answers must be. mostly, because I don't really think of OpenZFS as being a reason to choose Linux; if OpenZFS is the most important thing, then go for FreeBSD. so if you have to have Linux+OpenZFS, the choice depends on what you're doing

at minimum, something running an LTS kernel. anything that picks up a new kernel on day of release will have a bad time, because we usually don't have support for it in a stable OpenZFS release at that moment

if you don't need OpenZFS as the root/boot filesystem, then either a Redhat-ish or Debian-ish LTS. The RHEL-derivatives (Alma, Rocky) have probably the best support from upstream OpenZFS, since the big users are in education and research and those are almost exclusively RHEL. they don't ship it in their repos though; we provide package repositories for those. on the other side, Debian do ship it in their contrib repo, and their packagers work with us on the finer details, so its pretty solid

(in previous life as systems guy for a cloud service, it was Debian and locally-built OpenZFS, and it was just great)

if you do want OpenZFS as the root/boot, then I highly recommend ZFSBootMenu. it is basically an entire Linux+OpenZFS mini-distro in a UEFI binary as a bootloader, and brings things like FreeBSD-style boot environments to Linux. its is very very well thought out and understands the complications involved

I definitely _don't_ recommend GRUB for OpenZFS on root/boot, because it mostly doesn't keep up with new OpenZFS features, so you end up needing to keep a separate pool with a bunch of features disables, and you then need to take care to not `zpool upgrade` it (which, tbf, is a bit of a footgun in OpenZFS' tooling). it also doesn't really bring much to the table; iirc it doesn't understand snapshots/clones, and if you're not doing things like snapshot-before-upgrade, I'm not sure that OpenZFS root/boot is even worth the trouble

if you want OpenZFS in the installer, then options are far more limited. for general purpose Linux, I know Void Linux and CachyOS have installation options for OpenZFS. maybe Ubuntu too, though I'm never quite sure what the truth is on any given day. Void is by the same people that do ZBM, so that's very nicely integrated.

for "applicance" type things, Proxmox is popular, though I'd be more inclined to look towards TrueNAS CE because I know the OpenZFS devs there 😊 HexOS is an interesting-looking up-and-comer too. though really for an appliance-style usage, I'm far more likely to look towards a FreeBSD-based option (Sylve is looking _very_ interesting).

(disclosure on last para: I have in the past done paid dev work on OpenZFS for both TrueNAS and HexOS).

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Michael Lucas :flan_set_fire:
@mwl@io.mwl.io  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago
#FreeBSD has supported ZFS since 2008 and is considered a Tier 1 platform.

Ubuntu has supported ZFS since 2016 and is not.

#openzfsmastery#nonotryagain

Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol replied  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago
@span mwl we (#OpenZFS) do treat Ubuntu as something like "tier 1" (as in, every change gets tested there), but they don't treat it the same way. which mostly means that Ubuntu users will have a much nicer time of things if they get OpenZFS directly from us, rather than using Ubuntu's packages. it's all a bit weird really.
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Michael Dexter
Michael Dexter boosted
Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

I have a build of #OpenZFS working just nicely against #Linux next-20250911. You know, the one with the "Linux hates out-of-tree filesystems" change slated for 6.18, that is filling my DMs today.

This is not magic or heroism, just looking at the changes, thinking for a while, and doing the work. It took a morning.

Don't be sucked in by the noise and nonsense. Instead, trust that we've got your back, and are working hard to give you a filesystem that you can trust to take care of your data long into the future.

I'll also take a tip, if you're offering 💚
https://despairlabs.com/sponsor/

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Rob 💚
@robn@social.lol  ·  activity timestamp 3 weeks ago

I have a build of #OpenZFS working just nicely against #Linux next-20250911. You know, the one with the "Linux hates out-of-tree filesystems" change slated for 6.18, that is filling my DMs today.

This is not magic or heroism, just looking at the changes, thinking for a while, and doing the work. It took a morning.

Don't be sucked in by the noise and nonsense. Instead, trust that we've got your back, and are working hard to give you a filesystem that you can trust to take care of your data long into the future.

I'll also take a tip, if you're offering 💚
https://despairlabs.com/sponsor/

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Michael Dexter
@dexter@bsd.network  ·  activity timestamp 4 weeks ago

The recording of the September 10th, 2025 #OpenZFS Production User Call is up:

https://youtu.be/gM6M7cKhExs

We discussed OpenZFS native encryption password length requirements, inode conflicts on shared nested datasets, recent blogs posts, replication tools, and more!

"Don't forget to slam those Like and Subscribe buttons."

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Michael Dexter
Michael Dexter boosted
OpenZFS
@openzfs@mastodon.social  ·  activity timestamp 4 weeks ago

OpenZFS Vendors!

Please help us update our official list of companies providing #OpenZFS-based products and services:

https://openzfs.org/wiki/Companies

DM for contact information.

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OpenZFS
@openzfs@mastodon.social  ·  activity timestamp 4 weeks ago

OpenZFS Vendors!

Please help us update our official list of companies providing #OpenZFS-based products and services:

https://openzfs.org/wiki/Companies

DM for contact information.

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Michael Dexter
Michael Dexter boosted
OpenZFS
@openzfs@mastodon.social  ·  activity timestamp 4 weeks ago

The 2025 #OpenZFS User and Developer Summit is just over a month away and do make your travel plans before it’s too late!

https://openzfs.org/wiki/OpenZFS_Developer_Summit_2025

The event takes place in Portland, Oregon, USA October 25th through 28th

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