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@lauren @black @M0PWX @LeslieBurns I'm not sure that many people realise quite how bad a "typical smart TV" really is in terms of the information it gathers, retains and forwards from what most would regard as a private space.
@rvkennedy @black @M0PWX @LeslieBurns It's usually not awful as long as ACR is turned off. Even if you use a dumb TV (or just don't hook a smart TV up to the Net and only use HDMI inputs) the streaming services, etc. are going to know what you're watching on them, by definition.
@lauren
Streaming services don't see my OTA or my local media player (kodi) usage.
But my Roku is very invasive on too many levels.
@raft2551 @rvkennedy @black @M0PWX @LeslieBurns Streaming services see your usage of each respective streaming service. Naturally, otherwise they couldn't stream to you.
@lauren @raft2551 @black @M0PWX @LeslieBurns I think any typical user would expect that. What they would not expect, even if we discount GN's allegations, is the documented behaviour of ACR. That the maker of your TV is scanning whatever you watch from any source to build a profile of you and augment their database for advertising and other purposes. With ACR if you're aware that it exists you can disable it. Would any reasonable person choose not to? They rely on you not knowing.
@rvkennedy @lauren @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns
"Knowing what we watch" is a red herring. Providers will always know. It's about wifi scanning for nearby devices, audio eavesdropping, and general shitty shadiness.
@black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns It's impossible to provide voice control on any device from ambient sound (Google Home, Alexa, all the others) without processing the audio data continuously looking for the wake word. I don't care what's held locally in the box, I care about what's ACTUALLY sent to their servers, and all the systems I know of do that processing on the local device and only start sending data out after the wake word is detected.
@lauren @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns These devices were doing far more than what you are reducing it to, but you'd need to actually watch that video to be able to discuss this.
@black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns Yes, I've been through it now, and stand by my analysis. There isn't anything particularly special going on there. But it's great for clicks.
@black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns Understand that I've been dealing with privacy issues publicly for a very, very long time (since the 70s). So I've seen a lot and have a lot to compare with. One thing I learned along the way is to keep your eye on the ball. There are so many egregious privacy violations out there that spending time on the lower tier stuff is actually moving the ball in the wrong direction. That's one of the reasons I've never been able to get worked up much about targeted advertising, so long as it's in the disassociated model such as Google has always used. There are hundreds of similar examples that get a lot of publicity but actually divert attention from the really serious stuff. These days, concentrating on (most, there are exceptions) commercial abuses in general is a bad use of time -- it's the government, especially now, that is the real problem in this vein (though obviously, they are linked to the commercial space more and more so there is a partnership effect, especially with Big Tech under Trump eroding trust in Big Tech generally). All that said, despite the waves of privacy issues related to smart TVs over the years, I know of not a single serious case and the concerns have virtually always been speculative "what they could do" in nature. This is the same kind of reasoning the government is using to ban important and hard to replace Chinese-made products in the U.S. (drones, routers, etc.) and I consider it to be nonoptimal reasoning and bad policy.
@black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns And I'll add, with smart TVs, there is of course (unlike in most privacy issues) a very simple solution for anyone concerned. Don't connect it to the network, and do everything via the HDMI ports. You get a damned cheap TV anyway.
@lauren @black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns The uproar over Flock cameras is another example of focusing on the wrong thing. People want the Flock cameras removed so the police departments just quietly switch to another provider and the controversy goes away. It's like the game where you guess which cup has the ball under it.
@jmorris @black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns That's probably not a great analogy. There have been extremely serious consequences from those cameras. Innocent people held at gunpoint by cops, innocent people jailed for months based on errors in the system -- in one case I know of I think six months because of issues related to those cameras. And the many nightmarish stalking cases enabled by them. I don't see much evidence that people are differentiating based on brand. Police departments may be trying to switch from one to another, but bipartisan blowback from people has been so intense I don't see much political will to simply switch to another manufacturer and try carry on.
@lauren @black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns In the few stories I've seen, people were so hyper-fixated on the Flock brand name that they either didn't notice or weren't as upset when the cameras were swapped to a different ALPR company. I only bring it up to highlight the focus issue. PDs canceling Flock contracts, waiting for things to cool down then hiring a different company works in some cases. I'm glad what you are seeing shows people are lumping all these companies together.
@jmorris @black @rvkennedy @raft2551 @M0PWX @LeslieBurns Most of the bans are not brand specific.
