@aral This is not the case. See https://element.io/en/legal/ethics for the public ethics policy of who we sell to.
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@aral I am not sure, but after reading the linked message and have a quick look at the statement this reads like A.C.A.B at best. But more like policing is facism innits essence?
When I read your post I was like… 😬 this will generate a lot of discussion yet still a good post Aral :)
SIncerely
@aral @precariousmind @element Hahaha. So next time I see someone putting down Signal and boosting Matrix, I can say “signal isn’t run by fascist bootlickers.”
@MisuseCase @davidgerard @aral @precariousmind @element Well. Just for the sake of accuracy, matrix foundation includes people from element. They have strong ties. But matrix foundation is at least supposed to be neutral and mostly about the protocol. But it is hard to avoid element in the matrix ecosystem as of yet anyways. So I can see your point.
@prma @MisuseCase @aral @precariousmind @element so to be clear, you're saying Matrix are just the other ten guys at the table
@davidgerard @MisuseCase @aral @precariousmind @element No. I’m just saying that a protocol is just a contract between two devices.
You can implement and use matrix protocol without any involvement of the element people or even matrix foundation. Someone might.
Now is that something that happens today? Mostly not. But it is not like people implementing matrix specification are automatically sympathizing with element or matrix foundation.
@prma @MisuseCase @aral @precariousmind @element so you're saying the other ten guys at the table are also the Nazi at the table, but one day they might hypothetically *not* be. ok.
as you state:
> Now is that something that happens today? Mostly not.
that's fine news for the fabulous future, but you've been throwing up chaff about the present actually existing reality of how Element is Matrix, and you just admitted all this was throwing up chaff
@prma @davidgerard @aral @precariousmind @element So, I am not clear about all this stuff but Element is a coding platform, right?
@MisuseCase @davidgerard @aral @precariousmind @element I’m not sure what you mean by coding platform.
Element develops home server applications and client applications based on Matrix protocol. Sort of like how mastadon is to activitypub.
And they sell enterprise SaaS and support for these products as their business model. You can for example use conduit as the homeserver and lots of client apps. You then are not using element’s products but using matrix. (1/2)
But in practice it’s the same as mastodon and activitypub. Element has a huge market share and thus influence in the matrix space. Never mind the historical ties. (2/2)
@prma It sounds like it might be a little different from the relationship between Mastodon and ActivityPub but okay.
@MisuseCase @prma frankly it sounds much more like the relationship between the AT protocol and Bluesky Social PBC
@davidgerard @MisuseCase Hmmm. Might be? I’m not fluent in the AT protocol ecosystem. It’s just an imperfect analogy. My only point is that element and matrix are not exactly the same.
Don’t throw the baby with the bath water, even though that baby peed in the water and now we have a baby covered with its own pee, there might be some a horse riding a white knight that could wash this baby.
Anyhow, I like blogs. Communication is overrated.
@prma @MisuseCase they're not exactly the same, they're just literally the same fuckin guys in practice.
you're nitpicking a point that isn't a point in practice. element are fascists and matrix is so much element that the original statement is true in practice.
have you considered not stanning for nazis.
